The Coming Witnesses

Some good comments from all of you.  As we get closer to the Antichrist and the revealing of him there are many questions to ponder.  For instance the bible says in scripture he decieves the world, except the elect.  One thing to consider is will he be who the world expects him to be or will he be someone else altogether, someone the christian leaders never expected, from a place on earth never expected.  RYC Jacob-you made a good point when you mentioned what did the reformers think, and I think I know where your leading to on this question, and it is a good question.  So here is another question on truth.  Do we regard others outside of the bible, other’s opinions when it is not the word of God.  These are men, and sometimes women, just like us that have defects and problems and issues and prejudaces.  I’ll give you an example and maybe you can understand where I am coming from.

Martin Luther, the greatest and first reformmer of them all, God used, at a time when the church, Roman Catholic Church, God’s chosen church at that time, Holy roman Empire, was not reading the whole bible, was not teaching all of the bible and was teaching some things that Martin Luther considered nonscriptural, things like te selling of indulgences and other things designed to keep people under bondages and to raise more funds for the church.  So the reformation began with Martin Luther when he nailed on the Wurzburg castle university door his 99 problems with the Holy Roman Empire catholic Church.  And so began all the social upheavals and reformation all over Europe.  And we know this was the beginning of hundreds of years of inchurch bickering between the new protestors, the protestants, first being Lutherans, and the Catholics.  So the Catholic church counted Luther a wolf in sheeps clothing, a false prophet, an antichrist wanting to burn him at the stake, but never catching him but catching many other reformers and burning them at the stakes, leadind to many, many ,many martyres all in the search for God’s truth.

He was a great man used by God this Martin Luther.  But there are a lot of things in his writings people do not know.  Towards the end of Martin Luther’s life he had written many really bad antisemetic writings.  He was a jew hater.  I never believed this until I read his writings myself.  The point being, he was a man, a mighty man used by God, but not an apostle, not one of the original eleven, not selected by Jesus Christ in person in the desert like Paul was, when blinded.  So this man was on the one hand used to correct the church when darkeness was a great cloud covering everybody, but , history teaches, was what they called an antisemite, a jew hater.

So many of the reformers were being called false prophets, antichrists, and they thought this Holy Roman catholic Empire that was trying to burn them at the stake was also the seeds of a coming future false prophet or antichrist.

And lots of hurts and divisions and sectarianism started with these hundreds of years of wars, Catholic kings in charge, burning protestants at the stake, Protestant kings in charge, burning catholics at the stake, all leading to bitterness and hate the body of christ has never over come since then.

So could the reformers in all this termoil, all these clouds of hate, without history behind them have an accurate view of where the antichrist and false prophet kingdoms would come from?  Another question.  Would people living five to six hundred years before the antichrist came have the same accurate view as someone would three or four years befor the antichrist came?

And RYC Sara I  believe no one will know until right before he is revealed.  The scriptures do seem to support this view.

I tell you the truth and I will tell you this one time.. The Bible says he will decive EVEN the every elect if possible will be decieved you are incorrectly interperting the scripture as you are using it out of contexts. Its correct context says; “At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. See, I have told you ahead of time” (Matthew 24:23-25 (New International Version)

For this very reason we MUST have Pastor over churches as the Bible tells us not to limit what people learn but teach them SOUND doctrine. Also, as I have pointed out in my private message to you and on my website. The Catholic Church Leadership is a form of the anti-christ. I do not believe it was ever used by God, as it was created by a evil man for power. I believe just like in the Old Testament God keep people for himself. Just like he did in the day of Elisha. However, thats why I say even on my website about the missionarys that went out from the Catholic Church that they are in the hands of God. “Jehu will put to death any who escape the sword of Hazael, and Elisha will put to death any who escape the sword of Jehu. Yet I reserve seven thousand in Israel—all whose knees have not bowed down to Baal and all whose mouths have not kissed him’ So Elijah went from there and found Elisha son of Shaphat. He was plowing with twelve yoke of oxen, and he himself was driving the twelfth pair. Elijah went up to him and threw his cloak around him” (1 Kings 19:17-19 (New International Version).

I believe that God keep for himself a group that did now bow down to the Pope nor did they kiss his ring. I do regard what men of God say, however, I also read and put the word of God against what they say. I have Martin Luthers reasons for leaving the Church on my website. I believe if God set people aside for himself in the past then his can do it again. Also, if you read the Old Testament you will see this happen many times. I believe that God held the leadership accountiable for the lies and false teachings that the Catholic Church has pass or attempted to pass for truth. If it was not for Martin Luther you would not even have a Bible to read. Because the Catholic Church said that normal people can not understand the Bible which is a LIE FROM HELL.. All men with the Holy Spirit can fully understand the Bible.

by man i ment mankind

23At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. 25See, I have told you ahead of time.

26″So if anyone tells you, ‘There he is, out in the desert,’ do not go out; or, ‘Here he is, in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.

Above are the passages we are studying.  It says in verse 26″So if anyone tells you, “There he is, out in the desert,’ do not go out; or, “Here he is, in the inner rooms, ‘ do not believe it.

Now Jacob, you accused me of taking scripture out of of context, I do not believe I have, I am getting the feeling your getting upset or something.  I had no intention of getting you upset.  I have my views you have yours.  This I have no problem with.  We do not have to agree on everything.  I am just curious why you think I took it out of context, the passage above.

So what do you think Christ meant when he said that?

Ohhh yes, thank you for pointing that out.  I did say that, not on purpose though.  You are right it does not say that.  It says:

“to decieve even the elect–if that were possible.”

It was a freudian slip for me–because I do not believe it is possible to decieve the elect.

This is an interesting study though.  By Christ saying this it appears that the way the Antichrist will attempt to lead astray the elect, if that were possible.  This statement kind of insinuates something.  It insinuates seems to insinuate that the Antichrist will protray himself as a leader of the elect for how can you even “possibly” decieve the “elect” unless you protray yourself as a spiritual leader of the “elect.”  Just a thought….