Is Tithing Mosaic Law or no Law at all?
July 8, 2018 by
Does anyone know what midrash is and the importance of midrash in the Body of Christ? Midrash is a Jewish term related to a tradition of two high level theologians debating their stands on theology with an audience quietly listening. People may pose questions but they must be questions that are within the context of the discussion. So no one should pose a question that is not of that level theologically. The listeners get to learn with a “bird’s eye view,” so to speak of a discussion of what theologians think and what they base their theology on. We see this tradition exhibited by Jesus and the Pharisees throughout scripture in the four gospels. Everywhere in the four gospels we see Jesus being followed by the Pharisees and Sadducees discussing the truth of the scriptures. In no where in the gospels do we see either side interrupting the other side and arguing. Midrash is not arguing, nor is it debate in the modern sense and understanding of debate. Debate, often taught in high schools and colleges uses aggressive techniques to throw the other side off their defense of their position by many disrespectful means. That is not what Midrash is. Midrash never insults the other side. Midrash never interrupts the other side when it is their turn to speak. Midrash is pure free speech. One person gets the floor to present their position, the other side gets equal time to present their position all while the audience listens quietly deciding what the actual truth is. Christ did this everywhere he went. Christ never interrupted the Pharisees or anyone in opposite position to his. Jesus always gave everyone the free liberty to speak their position. Then Jesus took his turn after they were finish and taught exactly why that was wrong. the teaching of Christ was based upon the tradition of midrash.
Isn’t this completely different then we see today on cable TV and Dish TV? Modern civilization has lost this important tradition. I can only think of how many times I have turned to a channel and seen two politicians screaming over each other as if it is some sort of wrestling match. Nobody listens to each other anymore. they try to shut each other out through discord. They try to win the argument by insulting the other side.
Here is a midrash on an important false teaching in the body of Christ that is taught by more than 90% of the church today, the teaching of tithing. Some might say “isn’t 90% a confirmation through the Holy Spirit that the teaching is correct. No it is not. There are many times in church history when more than 90% of the Body of Christ was wrong about a certain issue of what they considered truth at the time. Two of many examples to prove my point. The Apostle Paul taught contrary to what more than 90.999% of the body taught at his Ministry’s zenith. Paul taught salvation by grace and grace only where the rest of the Body of Christ was teaching a mixture of mosaic law and grace embodied and explained later on by the Father Theologians of Christianity to be called the Judaiser movement (Judaizer (sic)). These Judaisers believed that before a gentile could get saved, at a time of the beginning when all Christians were Jews, they must first get not only circumcised but learn and follow all of the mosaic codes and laws (613 of them). The second example being Martin Luther’s teaching in his 99 theses against the selling of indulgences and the other improprieties of the Roman Catholic Holy Roman Empire.
Is it Judaiser or Judaizer?
Judaiser is the traditional spelling of the word to describe a large movement of first generation of Jewish Christians that were attempting to require the new gentile Christians to follow Mosaic law first and then get saved later. They were being required to get circumcised and learn the entire Mosaic law code and once they learned the code then and only then were they ready for salvation. Early Christian historians (Quote here)and and Martin Luther and one of the (Young) English bible from mid 1800’s spelled this word as Judaisers. There are also many PhD dissertations that also spelled it this way. In the last thirty years there have been a very large amount of new Christian sects, Church of God and Armstrongism sects, that do mix Mosaic law with grace that for some reason spell this word Judaizers and act like it is some form of slight against them or negative connotation as if some sort of offense should be taken even though they are not Jewish. So keep these things in mind when discussing these things that must be discussed in midrash form so no one is offended. It is usually that these people consider themselves some of the lost 10 tribes of Israel that settled in Great Britain around 700 B.C. and later becoming the modern day British. And this is what Armstrong preached. I prefer to spell it the traditional may of Judaisers since that is how it was originally spelled by the church Fathers when they were discussing these things.
After the Antioch Incident Christians were NOT Tithing
After the Antioch incident in the book of the Acts of the Apostles the Christians were NOT tithing. This indicates they thought of it as mosaic law at that time which the Apostle Paul preached against. One way we know this is the writings of
So these are only two of the numerous times the entire Body of Christ has been wrong. In fact the Body of Christ has been wrong more often than right, that is how common it is. it would be the exception if the entire Body of Christ were actually right, instead of wrong.
Christ dealt with tithing only twice in the New Testament, Matthew 23:23-24 and
So what causes so many to be wrong so often? No standard of truth. When few people were able to read and right during the time of Martin Luther it was easier for theologians to pull the wool over the eyes of the sheep in the Body. this was also true, even more so during the time of ChristPeople did not understand it was a new d. ispensation and the time of The New Covenant (also called the New Testament). it was so bad in that first generation of Christians with their constant promotion of mosaic law Christ is seen getting frustrated and scolding Peter teaching him it is more important to cleanse the inside of the cup rather than the outside, , (scripture Quote). we later even see the Super Apostle Paul scolding Peter for the same exact issues, Galatians 2:11-14.
Christ breathed 2/3rds of the New Testament through a personally selected Apostle he blinded in the desert to force him to realize the truth. This was divine providence to correct the churche’s already extensive incorrect teaching of mosaic law mixed with grace. Christ at this point had completely given up on the eleven Apostles having even a shred of capability in the teaching of God’s intended grace and pure grace only. This Judaiser movement has continually popped its head up to influence Christianity ever since beginning with the Roman Catholic church teaching the Mosaic law of tithing that was first taught by the Pharisees many of whom were responsible for the crucifixion of our lord Jesus Christ. It has never went away completely and resulted in many modern day sects of Christianity such as Seventh Day Adventists, Jehovah Witnesses, Mormonism of which are considered Christian cults heavily into tithing and Mosaic law, but elements of mosaic law that have poisoned most all of Christianity in one way or another. and is actually hidden from most Christian’s eyes and ears because they simply do not read their bibles. But soon these wolves that call themselves Preachers, blocking the pulpits so the true Preachers cannot Preach will be gone for they cannot cover the truth much longer with the new movement of Study Bibles now being spread throughout the world.
HERE IS A FALSE TEACHING ON TITHING ON JANJINS WEB SITE I RESPONDED TO.
WHY TITHE?
Key Scripture:
Malachi 3.8-12 ˜Will a man rob God? Yet ye have robbed me. But ye say, Wherein have we robbed thee? In tithes and offerings. Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts. And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts.
Genesis 14.20 And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thin
e enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all.
Genesis 22.17 That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies
No nation in the history of the world has been as economically blessed as the United States of America, save, perhaps, Solomon’s Israel. Since the end of World War Two, the U.S. Economy has steadily increased, improved, and grown, far out pacing the rest of the world (combined, in many instances). However, in recent days, huge ecomomic crises loom. In the past decade-and-a-half, the U.S. Economy has slowed down significantly. With the recent housing melt-down, skyrocketing prices for oil, and the depression of the American Dollar on the world stage, not to mention stiff competition from Asian Markets (particularly Red China and Japan) and the European Union, the U.S. Economy looks to be on the brink of disaster. Could there be a Biblical reason for the economic chaos and downturn in the United States of America? Is there a Biblical Solution? Lets take a look
Tithes = Ten Percent = Care for Gods House and His Workers In the Bible, we see the word Tithe quite often. What, exactly, is tithe? It is merely the first 10% of any kind of income or earning that a person makes. Time and time again in the Bible we see examples of men and women giving tithes, giving offerings, and brining gifts to God. In the Old Testament, the Children of Israel were instructed by God to bring in the first fruits of their earnings, whatever those earning were, to the Temple or the Tabernacle to give to God. These were to be given and consecrated to God, and if the person or family followed the instruction to bring their first fruit tithes to God, God, in turn, promised to bless the people. As promised, time and time again we see examples of how people were blessed by God for their giving. In fact, the only amount that God asked for in return was only the first 10% of whatever was earned; after giving, the rest of the earnings was to be used by the person who earned it. Even today, in these post-modern times, in the Church of Jesus Christ, people are called to tithe and to give their first 10% to God. The second reason to give to the tabernacle and temple (in the Old Testament) and to the Church (in the New Testament) was because it was the tabernacles/temples workers and Early Church Leaders only source of income. The Old Testament High Priests were forbidden to do any other work than to care for the spiritual well-being of the people. The tribe of Levi was designated to be the keepers of the tabernacle and temple, and to do all the maintainence work involved in it, and though they worked in rotation every so often, the times that they were workign in the temple or tabernacle provided them with their only source of income. Because of this, it was vitally important that the people tithed and gave offerings, for if no offerings were given, the tabernacle and temple would suffer. This was the same with regards to the Apostles of the Early Church. The Twelve who followed Jesus gave up their trades (four of them were fishermen), and as a result, when after Jesus had ascended these men were in the leadership and, as the Old Testament High Priests before them, were responsible for the spiritual well-being of the Early Church followers (see Acts 6.1-4). In the Church of Jesus Christ today, it is the same. Many pastors cannot have a second job, and as their only income is from the church where they serve, tithing and giving is of vital importance. Further, the reason so many Churches in the USA have maitainence problems and structural woes is because of the lack of tithing. An Evangelist said during a revival, “If people would simply tithe, there’d be no need for building or special event funds
Great King, Good King, Bad King, Worse King In looking at the Books of First Samuel through to Second Chronicles, it is easily evident that when the King of Israel, and later, of the divided kingdoms, tithed and gave offerings to God, his kingdom was blessed. There is no greater King of Israel in the Bible than David. Though King David sinned horribly, when he was right with God, his giving was regular, his tithes going to the House of God. ecasue of King Davids faithfulness, Israel was blessed, and that blessing was even more pronounced when Davids son Solomon took the throne. It is written in both I Kings and II Chronicles that under Solomon (so long as he remained faithful) that silver was accounted the same as we account gravel today! The trouble started when King Solomon left off serving God, which included tithing (I Kings 12). Only under the good kings of Judah was there any kind of an economic revival. In reading I Kings through the end of II Chronicles, it becomes clear to see that kings Asa, Jehoshaphat, Uzziah, Jotham, Hezekiah, and Josiah all prospered and lived in relative peace because they followed God wholeheartedly, again, including bringing tithes and offerings into God’s house. When evil kings were on the throne, or when a good king went bad (such as Kings Rehoboam, Abijah/Abijam, and Joash) and left off following God, that the prosperity vanished. When King Solomon left off following God with his whole heart and mind, and started following idols, his kingdom was not only take naway from him, but the economic prosperity of the people later vanished also, so much so that Solomon made the people of Israel to work like slaves.
Giant Economic Bears In the world today, we face economic problems like we have never before seen. Many speculators and economic pundits see $200-per-barrel oil as a reality in the very near future. Food costs are spiking primarily due to Western and Technologically Advanced Cpuntries attempting to wean themselves off of Arabian and OPEC Oil by means of growing food plants for Bio-fuels instead of for edible consumption, and the fact that weather problems and natural disasters” such as the cyclone that hit Myanmar/Burma and the massive quake in Sichuan China a few years ago” continue to wreak havoc in food-producing countries. This crunch is readily seen in the United States, where fuel costs, food prices, and transportational charges have all skyrocketed in the last year. Further, the housing boom that once was just two and three years ago is now a housing glut, thanks to the sub-prime interest rate and sub-prime loan dilemma, massive numbers of housing foreclosures, and once-dream-but-now-empty houses now filling cities and towns. Not only is this problem felt in the USA, but world wide, as banks in Japan and Europe have been hard hit by the sub-prime loan defaults. This has also caused many banks to hike up intererst rates in other areas, especially that of credit cards. No other nation on earth has as much credit card dfebt per person as the United States of America, with many people owing tens of thousands of dollars to creditors, all of this rotating in with high credit card interest rates. In the U.S. Mainstream Media, there has been talk of a recession thanks in large part to all of these economic woes coming home to roost for the American People. Both of the U.S. Presidential Candidates from the two major parties are talking aobut solutions to these problems, but both Senators John McCain and Barack Obama seem not to have really any true sense nor strategy on how to prop up the faltering U.S. Economy. What, then, is the solution?
Tithing The Key to Gods Blessings If the United States (or any other country, for that matter) really and truly wants Gods blessings, the answer is simple: tithe. In Malachi 3, our Key Scriopture for today, God states clearly that if we as a people and a nation will tithe” not just individually, but collectively, as a nation” he will bless us, insomuch that he will open the windows of heaven and we will be a blessing to others. For the first 200 years of our existence as an Independent Nation, this is exactly what the United States experienced. No other nation in history has accomplished what the United States has in such a short time. It took England a millennia to build up to her world-wide Empire as seen in the late 1800s under Queen Victoria. France” lonmg a worldwide power, whose armed might was feared across Europe and the world, took a similar amount of time to become the great nation that she has been. The same can be said for all of the Ancient Powers, such as Rome, Han and Tang China, Egypt, greece, and Persia. however, the United States has become a prosperous nation in less than three and-a-half centuries. There can be only one explanation for such a rapdi rise to greatness: the blessings of God Almighty. The flip side of that coin can be stated with just as much proof, clarity, and evidence: The USA is suffering economically because Gods hand of blessing has been withdrawn, or is wthdrawing. Unless and until the USA both collectively as a nation and as individual people start to give God his due and proper respect, we will continue to suffer. This writer would daresay that if the United States would begin to give back to God merely 10% of our National Income on a regular vbasis, ALL of these hard economic problems would disappear, most of them overnight.
A Modern Example A modern example of how God is blessing a nation and a people because of faithfulness to him is the Republic of Korea (commonly referred to as “South Koreaâ€). Depending on the pollster, the Christian Population of the Republic of Korea is anywhere between 47% and 51% of the total. Though South Korea is feeling some of the economic crunch that has come about as of late, the Economy of South Korea has grown steadily since the end of the Korean War (1950-53). Unlike her East Sea Neighbor, Japan, South Koreas economic growth has been steady, efficient, and self-sustaining. In 2007, the United States signed a free trade agreement with South Korea, something that was eagerly sought by the United states (and rather opposed by a good number of South Koreans). Though South Korea is a small country with a small population, her economic growth is very srtrong, with many of her industries being sought by international corporations for partnership. South Korea could be a major economic player internationally in the future, if her gorwth continues. The reason why South Korea has seen this economic growth is because of the faithfulenss of South Korean people to God, and the fact that South Koreans give and tithe to their churches.
Conclusion: Economic Problems Happen because People Stop Tithing When a person stops tithing, financial ruin on a personal basis is just around the corner (this writer knows and understands first-hand what can happen to an individuals finances when s/he ceases tithing). The same is true for a nation. When a country and its people cease to give God his requested 10%, economic ruin, chaos, and problems will abound. The only way to truly end major economic crises is to tithe, plain and simple. God even says to try him and test him in this. He has promised to open up the windows of heaven for blessing. This writer believes that if President Bush were, tomorrow, to enact an Executive Order, giving ten percent of the Nations Income to God, our oil woes, housing crises, energy problems, and high food costs would disappear like fog in a hot, Summer, noon-day sun. Until we as a nation and as a people do the same, financial crises will be the norm. So long as we ignore God, his promises, and his requests, denying him his first fruit tithes, we will suffer economically.
Prayer Heavenly Father, it is simple, clear, and easy to see: when we tithe, you bless. When we withhold, you allow cursing and crises. Help us all to see this and understand you clearly today, we pray, in Jesus Name, Amen.
Verse to Remember:
And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall the vine cast her fruit before her time in the field,†saith the LORD of hosts. And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land,†saith the LORD of hosts.
Malachi 3.11-12
All this is untrue, un-scriptural nonsense. Tithing IS mosaic law and Paul stated over and over in his many letters if Mosaic law is preached for righteousness or blessing sake it is a false gospel that leads away from the true gospel of grace. Paul called this this other gospel. This is the one that seems right but isn’t right. This is actually why most preachers preach Paul’s letters out of context and quote them in bits and pieces because they do not like what Paul preached. That we are not under mosaic law, we are not under tithing, we are not under Sabbath followings, not under moon festivals, not under feast followings, nor any even one of the 613 laws or regulations of the mosaic law system.
God Bless,
Brother RobertLeeRE
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Jason says:
I, personally, have tried the Scriptures, and found them true. When I failed to tithe, there wasn’t enough. When I did tithe, bills paid and some left over. Malachi speaks to this. Again, I’ve proven it and found it to be true. Christ indirectly mentions being stingy with God when he spoke the parable to rich man and the tearing down of his barns to build bigger ones. He did not mention ten percent, but he did say generosity towards God was important. He also encouraged Peter to pay the temple tax. Also, Abraham gave ten percent BEFORE the Mosaic Law established it. Again, I have tried these Scriptures and fund them true. May not get all that i want from God when I tithe, but he sure makes certain food is on the table, gas is in the car, bills are paid, and life is taken care of. Not so much when I skimp out on him.
Blessings,
Jaso
So with your logic and reasoning of scripture Abraham also circumcised before the Mosaic law also. He also made sacrifices. Are you also saying we are to be circumcised so we may be blessed of God and more holy since you are saying that on tithing? I just do not see where scripture indicates we should even use the word tithing in our preaching. Offering yes, tithing no since many would get confused and think all Mosaic law is better which I know you do not recommend. Don’t you see the obvious contradiction here? When we constantly use the wrong words we are feeding the sheep to the wolves for they think that means they should follow all Mosaic law. In fact Paul States when we follow just one law of the Mosaic law system God will judge us whether we follow the rest of the Mosaic law system. are you saying that tithing is NOT Mosaic law? What about circumcision, is that Mosaic law? Because circumcision was also before Moses also yet Paul called it Mosaic law and Preached against it. All church dogma comes from Paul so we cannot do anything that contradicts what Paul Preached was truth. What Paul states is the test of truth, not what some Preacher states, just saying,
God Bless.
Brother RobertLeeRE
Interesting topic Jason,
Actual quotes please. For from my extensive research Christ NEVER used the term tithe anywhere except in a negative connotation when speaking of the various rich people that DID tithe right before the old woman put the copper coin in the offering plate Mark 12:41-44, Luke 21:1-4. That means not even Once. Same is true with Paul. Could you please give me the scriptural quote so we can midrash this false teaching (I claim) so others may learn the indefensable position of Tithing and mosaic law. I guarentee you everywhere you look tithing and mosaic law is looked down upon by Christ. In fact Christ was repeatedly scolding the Apostles over their constant elevation of the soundness of mosaic law principals. Here is exact quotes from the NIV of these scriptures. I also quote the prior paragraph so one can determine the context of the paragraph we are talking to understand what Christ is saying.
Mark 12:38-44
“38 Watch out for the teachers of the law. They like to walk around in flowing robes and be greeted in the marketplaces, 39 and have the most important seats in the synogouges and the places of honor at banquets.
“39 They devour widows’ houses and for a show make lengthy prayers. Such men will be punished most severely.”
The Widow’s Offering
41Jesus sat down opposite the place were the offerings were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the temple treasury. Many rich people threw in large amounts. 42 But a poor widow came and threw in two very small copper coins, worth only a fraction of a penny. 43 Calling his disciples unto him, Jesus said, “I tell you the truth, this poor widow has put more into the treasury than all the others. 44 They all gave out of their wealth; but she, out of her poverty, put in everything–all she had to live on.”
Now in these scriptures above right before Christ’s teaching on giving he had a prime opportunity to teach the so called law of tithing. BUT HE DID NOT! He could have commended some and scolded others yet he did not. He could have went into how tithing is or is not mosaic law but he also did not do that. As important as most of the body of Christ claims you would think that it would at least qualify as a mention here. Christ did not mention. But Christ chose to mention the Widow who gave in her poverty. But he did not mention that either. Surely someone in this group tithed at least, for how important tithing is many say, yet not mention. SILENCE! Sometimes silence teaches more than anything. Surely the old widow deserved to be commended for tithing, tithing out of her poverty yet nothing but silence. Christ then ignores the teaching on tithing and teaches how what the woman gave was out of her poverty, far more than the Pharisees, surely some were Pharisees for Pharisees where not just servants of the temple but they were also a very large political class at that time in Israel. The Pharisees many , in fact most did not where robes but just the ordinary clothes of that generation. Surely some were Pharisees yet they were not commended because tithing was part of the code that would soon be nailed to the cross itself according to Paul in Colossians 2:13-15. Lets now read the Apostle Paul’s words to the Colossians.
Colossians 2:13-15
13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, 14 having cancelled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood apposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. 15 And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.
But lets not stop there but continue…
Colossians 2:16-22
16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. 18 Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you for the prize. Such a person goes into great detail about what he has seen, his unspiritual mind puffs him up with idle notions. 19 He has lost connection with the Head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows as God causes it to grow.
20 Since you died with Christ to the basic principals to the world, why, as if you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules: 21 “Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!”?
22 These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based upon human commands and teachings. 23 Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom, with their self imposed worship, their false humility and their harsh treatment of the body, but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence.
They are watch the givers putting funds into the temple treasury. Christ is teaching the desciples. He has their attention yet what gives??!??? Christ skips it over completely, he even has something very negative to say about the rich. I am sure some of the rich
Also, the very ones that did follow Christ and mosaic law didn’t like Paul or Christ and were constantly trying to set them up to be flogged or killed. The ones that followed mosaic law were against the gospel from the very beginning. Even Christ’s own family were so heavily involved in mosaic law they were never even recorded sitting at Christ’s feet during the entire 31/2 year ministry. If it wasn’t for the preaching of Paul the gospel would never have reached the gentiles and Christianity would have just been another cult that lived and died over a 100 year period. Rome would never have been conquered and Christianity would have died off within 50 years post 2nd temple destruction.
The only way to conclude Christ taught tithing would be to use eisegesis and quote Christ out of the context of what Christ was actually speaking of. When considering the mountain of new Testament evidence One can only conclude this is also another long lost chapter of mankind adding words to God’s words just like the Catholics did until the 1500’s.
The only time came even close to teaching tithing he actually never even used the word tithing and spoke in practicality sense when speaking of the widow that put only two copper coins in the offering plate and out of her poverty put way more then than the tithers that were behind her. This is actually evidence against using the word tithing because for some reason Christ had a PRIME opportunity to use the word tithing but he never did. And the reason he did not is because he knew it was an actual contradiction of the New Covenant that would be preached by the Super apostle Paul. It is wrong to even use the word Tithing and that is why Christ never did use it. And I do not know why your saying Paul also recomended tithing, he did not. I do not know why you would say that. So i can only assume you are actually unaware of what it does state. We all have done that. We thought the bible said one thing and we look and realize it states something completly opposite and polar. I have studied all of Paul’s Epistles thoroughly and it just isn’t there. Neither did any Apostle preached tithing. Not even James which would have been the one that would for he Jesus brother and yet never followed Christ till after the resurrection. Even Christ’s own family was scared to confront the corruption in the Mosaic law system. It is the same today. Good Christians everywhere but unwilling to stand up for the truth that tithing is mosaic law.
God Bless,
Brother Robert
Robert, with all due respect, I could ask you the same: where are actual quotes from Christ Jesus and Paul where they repudiate tithing? The references in the Gospels where Jesus mentions tithing he is not repudiating tithing but the heart of the tither. Paul is actually praising Abraham for giving a tenth of the spoils to King Melchizedek in Hebrews 7. Nowhere in the Bible does anyone repudiate tithing.
You may see it as a Mosaic law, but the fact that Abel, Abraham, Jacob, Isaac, and others gave ten percent back to God proves that tithing transcends the Laws of Moses. It was already a Godly practice before Moses wrote it down in the Pentateuch, and the Book of Malachi basically confirms the fact that it is a Godly thing to do and that not doing it is akin to robbing God. Ezra and Nehemiah mention tithing in similar fashion. I am truly sorry that you see giving back ten percent to God as a “law†because every church I have ever been a part of, every pastor I have ever heard preach on the subject, and every scripture that I have read concerning tithing leads me back to seeing it as
(1.) a decision to place trust in God (do we trust him to give him the first tenth of everything we earn, or are we going to distrust him and give him the leftovers, if anything? Either we are trusting God and his written Word, or we aren’t, its that simple),
(2.) a joy to do and not a detriment,
(3.) it is a form of worship and praise to God, and
(4.) every time it has been done, naught but blessings follow. I can truly say that tithing has done nothing but good to every person I’ve ever known who tried it, to every business that dared to do it, and to every church that has undertaken the practice of it on a corporate church level. The church where my Dad pastors has tithed according to the Biblical form of it and to date, they have never missed a bill, never missed a missions or church district budget, and they have funds left over in order to help others…just like the Book of Malachi states and where God promises.
We can talk all day about words that Christ Jesus used and never used. He did use the word, and again, it wasn’t in negative fashion towards tithing but towards the heart of the one tithing (and the Bible does talk A LOT about offerings and sacrifices given with a wayward, sinful heart). Paul, as well, never talked about tithing in a negative fashion and, in fact, praised the Church at Thessalonica concerning their giving over and above in order to help those suffering in Jerusalem and elsewhere. The fact of the matter is, tithing is no where repudiated by anyone in the Bible, and is, in fact, shown to be a means of blessing to those who have done it. Further, I have never read where Christ scolded anyone for following the law. How could he do so, considering his words in Matthew 5? What he admonished his disciples and the pharisees and Jewish leaders about concerned the heart, not the letter of the law. The Pharisees, Sadducees, Herodeans, Zealots had double-mindedness and hearts that were not with God. Their sacrifices and their giving was out of pride, not out of love for God. Tithing is about loving God and trusting him, and if we really want to get to the heart of the matter with tithing and Jesus’ words, in truth everything we have is his. After all, the Book of Acts, especially the first four chapters mention how the Early Church gave everything they had for the common good of those who believed, including money and the entire price for land and possession and holdings that they sold. In truth, Robert, if we are God’s and we trust Christ, EVERYTHING WE HAVE is his. The fact that he only asks for ten percent in return is testament to that truth. Again, we, as a family, give ten percent because we love Christ, we turst him, and we are choosing to identify with him. It isn’t because we fear some law or the fires of hell or cursing and curses; its because we love Christ Jesus and want to identify with him and we want to worship him.
If you truly want to talk Mosaic Law, then lets talk Mosaic Law, because many of the beliefs that we, as Christians, hold dearly to spring out of the Laws of Moses. Tithing transcends Mosaic Law. We don’t do it as a duty, but out of love. It is done as a gift to the LORD and to his church. I daresay that if everybody in the church tithed, our Pastors would very likely live much better than they do, and would be abler in their work.
Blessings,
Jason
Well, if we’re gonna’ get down to brass tacks, then by all means. First of all, there is not one verse of Scripture where tithing is denounced. There is not even one. No where in the New Testament does Jesus Christ denounce or downplay tithing or giving ten percent. No where in Scripture does Paul denounce tithing. Here is what Christ says: “Render unto Caesar that things that are Caesar’s and unto God the things that are God’s.†(Matthew 22.21; Mark 12.17; Luke 20.25). What are the things of God? I won’t stretch logic or presume anything except that the things that belong to God are not only my life and limb and everything that I have given him physically and spiritually, but also every single cent I make as a professor of ESL. The ten percent my wife and I return to God in the form of giving to his church is merely a symbol of our love for and allegiance to Jesus Christ. It is not a pathway to salvation as my wife and I give because we are already saved. It is not an obligation to anything save an obligation to joy and a form of worship. As such, tithing is merely a symbol of our dedication to God. Circumcision is simply another symbol of the promise given to Abraham and his descendants. This is what Paul was arguing in the Books of Acts, Galatians, and the Corinthians, and the reason he did so is simply because some of the early church’s jews were declaring that salvation came through circumcision as mentioned in Acts. His argument was against those who were attempting to take something that was and is symbolic and force it upon the Gentiles as an avenue of salvation. Water Baptism is also simply an indication, and identification, and a symbol of what Christ Jesus has done on the inside. At the same time, tithing is also an avenue of blessing. In Malachi, God promises blessings to those who bring the whole tithe into the storehouse. He also promises blessings for those who bring the firstfruits of their income to the storehouse as well in the Books of Moses. Abraham, again, was blessed by Melchizedek and by God because he gave ten percent of the spoils to the King following the battle in which he rescued Lot.
In this argument, I have maintained that both tithing and circumcision transcend the law. both, Robert, ARE and WERE before the law. Deny it all you wish, but Abraham lived 500 years before the laws were set on parchment and in stone. As I have also pointed out time and again, tithing and circumcision are also saddled with blessings and benefits, again as promised by the Bible. Again, you are free to deny the blessings that these come with all you wish, but the fact remains that God made promises to those who followed circumcision and tithing, promises that still stand today. Is circumcision an avenue of salvation? No, it is not as salvation was completed at the cross. Is tithing an avenue of salvation? No, it is not as Christ completed salvation at the cross. Again, are both of these saddled with blessings from God if we practice them? Yes, they are because they are, again, symbols of dedication to God and reminders of the promises God made to not only Abraham, but to those who dare to follow in his footsteps and become friends with God. In other words, circumcision is a means of identification with God’s promises as is tithing. Circumcision comes with many benefits as the Bible mentions and maintains. Tithing also comes with blessings also mentioned on the Bible.
Now, you are all but demanding me to provide you with verses that prove Christ taught tithing. I’ve given you three indirect ones in the passages concerning giving to Caesar and to God the things that belong to them. But here’s the thing, Robert: even before you asked of me proof, I asked you to provide instances where Christ Jesus taught and preached and spoke against tithing. So far, you ” with all due respect” have avoided these questions. Again, where did Paul denounce tithing? This, too, is a question I’ve already asked, and, despite your assertion that you can back up your claims with 100% accuracy, you still have yet to post one verse where Paul denounces, discourages, and/or states that tithing is anything but Godly. I’ve already posted averse where Paul states that we not only need to give, but give generously and with a cheerful heart and spirit. Christ Jesus mentions this, as well (another indirect teaching concerning tithing, though the word isn’t specifically mentioned)
But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?’ So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.†—Luke 12.20~21
This verse here shows that Christ is admonishing his listeners to give richly (certainly meaning more than 10%). As I stated time and again before, with Christians, everything belongs to God. He has every right to demand (let alone ask) for all of it to be laid upon the altar yet he only asks for a ten percent increase.
But let us take your premise, Robert, concerning tithing being of the law and we are not supposed to follow the law. Here is an interesting verse Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law Hebrews 10.8
According to this verse and others like it, offering is of the law. That means, if I give a free will offering, it is of the law. If we follow your premise, Robert, that we — as Christians aren’t supposed to be following the law, then according to this verse right here, Paul is denouncing all forms of giving as they are of the law. So why Give? Why give anything to the Church or to God or to the work of Jesus Christ? After all, it is of the law. Why give? We can say the same about assembling together: the males of the Israeli were required to assemble three times a year to offer and to give praise to God. According to the Law of Moses, this was required and anyone who failed to do so were to be cut off from their people. Why assemble together? After all, it is of and by the Law of Moses. I could go on and on and on about a lot of the laws of Moses. You are familiar with the homosexual assault on the Bible, I am sure: if abhorring homosexuality is mentioned in the law of Moses, should we abhor homosexuality? If bestiality is an abomination in the eyes of God according to the Law of Moses, should we denounce it? Disciplining rebellious teen children is also mentioned in the Law of Moses. Because of this, should we as Christians let our teen children rebel and forego discipline? After all, Paul preached against righteousness being of the law. Why, then, do we abhor homosexuality, rebellious teens, and bestiality? Why, also, do we abhor and detest, as Christians, the sins of murder, infanticide, theft, covetousness, ALL sins? Simply put because these things are not right, and they transcend the Laws of Moses because they are not right in God’s eyes. Abel was murdered by Cain long before God told Moses Thou Shalt Not Kill. As such, we, as Christians and Bible students, know that murdering is wrong. Killing a baby is wrong because Pharaoh was killing babies long before God ever had his authors write that he knew babies and saw them in the womb. This is why we follow such and stand against abortion, not because its written Thou shalt not kill in the Law. This is why we stand against homosexuality, bestiality, and rebellion in anyone, teen or not: they are wrong and were wrong long before God had them written in the law. Same said for circumcision and tithing and practice of both: we do them because God deemed them good and right long before Moses took pen and parchment and wrote them down. The Book of Malachi only reinforces this idea of tithing being Good, as does Christ’s teachings on being rich towards God and tithing out of a pure and right heart. Tithing transcends the law and it should be done, especially if one is a Christian and wanting a closer relationship with the LORD again, tithing won’t gain anyone a second inside the Gates of Heaven because Jesus Christ has already paid the price for entry into Heaven. Neither will baptism, circumcision, Bible reading and study, prayer (aside form the Sinner’s Prayer) or any other thing we can do that is deemed a work.
I’m not sure if this will suffice to explain why we as a family and I as a singular person tithe my salary and all other income to the church and to God. Again, for the fourth time (I think; I’ve lost count) tithing isn’t some thing I do to gain heaven, out of obligation or coercion, or something that I must do to gain God’s favor. It is something I do because I love Jesus Christ and want the world to know that I love him and that he has saved me from my wretched, despicable, terrible sins. I tithe as a joy, not as a job (and Father help me that it never becomes such!). I follow Christ Jesus example and give to him because its his anyway, just as he mentions in Matthew 22, Mark 12, and Luke 20. Why is it his? Not only because I gave it to him more than thirty years ago, but because it was his to being with anyway.
I hope that this makes things clearer.
In Christ,
Jason
the sermon joke
There was an 80 year old woman getting married for the 4th time
As reported in the news…An 80 year-old woman was recently married to her 4th husband. A reporter questioned the occupation of her newly acquired husband. She replied that he owned a funeral home. Curious about the other husbands, the reporter also asked about their occupations. The woman paused for a while and stated that her first husband was a banker. The second one she was madly in love with and he was a circus master. The third one was a minister. Puzzled by her answers, he replied, “None of these people have anything in common! Why did you marry these?” She stated that she married number one for the money, two for the show, three to get ready, and four to go.Benediction
Dear heavenly Father who gave his only begotten Son Jesus Christ to save us from ourselves when we do not deserve it. Intercede for us Lord, your Father has shown mercy upon our souls and even then you still sent the Holy Teacher Spirit to awaken those that had walked with you, listened to you… sitting at your feet. You fed the 5,000 so they would not have to leave being at your feet, adoring you, listening to consider every word you spoke. We cry out Lord asking, begging and pleading that you create in us a clean heart, a sound heart, a heart that is soft that you may mold it, knead it, a heart pumping with life and not of dry brittle stone. May we become witnesses for your truth Lord, witnesses that never walked with you Lord, witnesses rejecting the words of men instead of children rejecting the words you breathed through your prophets. May you now breath through your witnesses Lord the truth of the scriptures without men’s words, showing us the failure of our ways, waking us up, strengthening us that we will repeatedly refuse to follow the false prophets that teach the scripture to say something other then what is there, something other then your words Lord. May all scriptures we read be revealed that we may become witnesses to truth Lord Jesus Christ, Amen.
To Tithe or Not to Tithe
First off people take a deep breath before you investigate this truth I teach. The act of tithes is not in any way related to donating. We are not talking about whether or not we should support our local church or Preacher. Of course we should always pay for the services we receive. Anybody that teaches the word of God to you deserves to receive the appropriate compensation related to the blessings you received no ifs ans or buts. But this is important and must be addressed by the body of Christ. It has been ignored far too many centuries and We are talking about Mosaic law and whether calling your offerings tithes or following the act of tithes as a principal of holiness in which the person following these laws would expect preferential treatment from God, or rewards or return a 100 fold. So here are some basic questions I wish everyone to ponder…
Here is an article written by a friend of mine on tithing. What are your thoughts on tithing? Does the bible support it? Or against it? What scriptures do you give that support what you believe?
You can go to his site here: He no longer blogs on Xanga and closed his site. We all miss him a lot. He had some pretty good teaching but this is one area I believe he was wrong and needed more spiritual maturity. Why godly men will not discuss this issue in a public forum, I do not know.
Tithes
First tithes are completely biblical (Numbers 18:27-29, Malachi 3:7-9). We must pay tithes in order to keep the lights on in our local churches, and to make sure the Pastors of our Church have the ability to devote themselves to study. If you want to go to College do you not pay whatever it cost in order to learn? If you want to learn Martial Arts do you know pay a teacher? If this applies to those who are lost and dieing this BIBLICAL truth must be applied to the Christian. You say but I have no money, as I am in the same boat then the bible tells us to bring our special gifts and give them to the lord (Deuteronomy 12:10-12). Granted when I do have money I tend to give it to the Church, however I do not do this for the Church I do this unto God.
We can see this also in work in the NT, (Matthew 6:2-4) many people may attempt to say yes but the church is not needy. However does the church not help those who are in need both spiritual and physically? Therefore, when you give to the Church you are helping those that are in need you are supporting missionaries you are supporting your local congregation.
As far as answering the rest of your questions I need examples. I do not believe all Christian Organizations are bad. I do however, believe that many of them are confused and need to be redirected. However, there are many that are bad as they say that homosexuality is ok and they say that we no longer need to stay separate from the Catholic Church which preaches something other then the Bible. I do believe that many organizations have taken the Bible out of its proper place. However, not all have Christian Organizations have done this.
Here’s my response to his article and why I believe the bible does not support tithing.
Tithes Are One of the 613 Mosaic Laws Christ and Paul Preached Against
Mosaic law is from the old covenant that we are not under according to the greatest Apostle Paul. I say the greatest because 2/3rds of the entire New Testament was breathed by God through him.The word tithing is not even mentioned in the New Testament as something we should follow or do.
The only time Christ mentioned tithes was in a negative tone commending only the person that did not tithe but gave in her poverty a copper coin followed by Pharisees and Sadducee s that did tithe. Christ said she gave more then them in her poverty. He had a prime time to teach the act of tithes and the common 100 fold return all Preachers preach yet Christ has only negative things to say about the ones following the code.
The Apostle Paul never mentioned we were to tithe and in fact claimed the entire Mosaic Code was nailed to the cross by Jesus himself, Colossians 2:13-15. In his many letters he used examples of mosaic law and regulations stating if we follow even one law we placed ourselves under the entire code and had to follow the entire code which was impossible.
Mark 12:41-44; Luke 21:1-4. Christ had a perfect opportunity to teach on tithing yet he never even mentioned the law because we, according to the Apostle Paul’s doctrine which is greater then any denominational doctrine including Baptist, Methodist, Pentecostal, Assemblies of God, church of God, Charismatic, Nondenominational, Jehovah Witness, Mormon and any other followers of any laws in the Old Testament. The Apostle Paul’s church dogma trumps all Christian religions and they cannot ignore Paul’s words. Nor can they ignore members authority which is given by God through the Holy Spirit to the bible and to you. They have to teach the same words as Paul or be pestered on and on by the witnesses to truth of the gospel taught by Paul through the Pauline Epistles which is a greater authority then them.
The fact of the matter is Christ’s greatest struggles were with the “Godly Law followers” of the mosaic law system including the mosaic law of tithing. Also these law followers were constantly accusing Christ of breaking the laws like healing people on the Sabbath and doing things they were not supposed to be doing on the Sabbath. Christ was also accused of eating with unclean people and not performing hand-washing rituals before eating. Christ constantly challenged this mosaic law system not by breaking them but by following God’s original intention of these laws.
Paul states in Galatians chapter 3:10 if you follow any of the laws of the mosaic law system, tithing included, you place yourself back under the law and become cursed unless you follow all 613 laws of the Old Testament, Old Covenant. In other words you become a hypocrite incapable of choosing which laws to follow and which not.So my questions to you lawfollowing tithers is this; When was the last grain offering you did? Burnt offering? Fellowship Offering? Guilt Offering? Sin Offering? When was the last time you celebrated the Feast of Tabernacles living and dwelling in a booth for a week? And you women–Did you have a priest purify you after you gave birth to your children? How about all the food you eat. is it Kosher and has it been blessed by a Rabbi? Do you like your meat juicy? Because blood is forbidden according to mosaic law, not to be eaten. How about Sabbath. Who’s going to church on Sunday? Your breaking Sabbath law. Have any of you spoke bad things or cursed your mother and father anytime in your life? You are to be put to death according to mosaic law.
Now let us see what the greatest apostle ever in the New Covenant stated about mosaic law.
Galatians 3:3-5 Are you so foolish! After beginning with the Spirit, are you now trying to obtain your goal by human effort? Have you suffered so much for nothing-if it really was for nothing? Does God give you his Spirit and work miracles among you because you observe the law, or because you believe what you heard?
In fact if you will just open your bibles and read the whole book of Galatians you will find that Paul repeats this over and over and over in the whole book. This is only five pages people, please read it and follow what God says. Don’t you think this is better then to be following some denomination with a group of blind sheep?
1st Corinthians chapter 9 Paul states in this whole chapter how he deserves support but never mentions the word tithing because tithing is mosaic law. The teaching is that the giving is between God and the giver not the pastor and the giver.
1st Corinthians 4:16 Paul urges all that teach and pastor to imitate him. This includes preaching the same things Paul did. He never preached tithing because tithing is the mosaic law system and is the Old Covenant, we curse ourselves if we follow the law of tithing.
Romans 2:25 Circumcision has value if you observe the law, but if you break the law, it is though you had not been circumcised.
Romans 1:17 All righteousness is by faith from 1st to last, not from following any mosaic law.
Ephesians 2:15 by abolishing in his flesh the law, [mosaic law including tithing], with it’s commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man, [New Covenant], out of the two, thus making peace, and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility.
God-followers who follow mosaic law are dogs, men who do evil and mutilators of the flesh, put no confidence in mosaic law and the flesh. Philippians 3:2.
Philippians 3:9 Following mosaic law is rubbish. Righteousness does not come from following mosaic law but through faith.
And Paul repeats these same themes in the whole letter people. Read this letter, it is only 31/2 pages long.
Colossians 2:14 Having canceled the written code, with it’s regulations, that was against us and stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.
Mosaic laws and tithing depend on human tradition not Christ, Colossians 2:8.
Read the full letter of Colossians from Paul, it is only 31/2 pages long.
Now Read go to the four gospels and read them start to end. Christ was crucified by the followers of the mosaic law. In fact this is what all the disciples were all martyred over mostly. Mosaic law, tithing, is the Old Covenant.
All of Paul’s struggles were with a group called the Judaisers, messianic Christians. All the first Christians were messianic and they formed a group called the Judaisers. Their headquarters were in Jerusalem. This group was more against Paul then probably the Orthodox Jews. They believed the only way a gentile could get saved was to first learn all 613 mosaic laws, Regulations, Feasts, and circumcision rites and pass the required tests. then they could get saved.
Paul taught you are a hypocrite and cursed if you teach to follow only some of them. You see you cannot pick and choose which mosaic laws you are going to follow and which you are going to ignore. It doesn’t work that way. It is either all or grace, no in between.
Christ had a perfect opportunity to teach on the mosaic law of tithing right after scolding the followers of the law and pharisees, yet he didn’t [even] mention the word tithing. In fact the rich ones who tithed large amounts of money were not as godly as the widow who put in only a copper coin, Mark 12:41-44. So Christ taught the widow put more in from her poverty, yet curiously, he never mentioned more then 10% either. He only taught more then them because out of her poverty. Yet this was a prime time for Christ to teach the tithing mosaic law, but he didn’t.
Nobody tithes more then the Jehovah Witnesses and the Mormons which preach heavily on mosaic law. Many consider these cults. Truth does not come from following mosaic laws but becomes obscured and cloudy.
This is not from God and there is no scriptural support except a bunch of misled pastors trying to grow their congregations by heaping mosaic laws on peoples shoulders so they do not have to do their jobs and preach a sermon worthy of receiving donations.
When Christ sent the seventy how to witness door to door he told them to not bring a purse, no bedroll, no extra tunic or extra shoes, and no money. All preaching was to be done in faith.
Maybe when the church starts preaching this way again the corruption will end. It is hard though for all the people in the peanut gallery say “Praise the Lord” while the false prophets preach a false gospel based on man’s ideas instead of the scriptures.
Here are some of my comments on this sermon from my other blog:
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